S1 E2 Inclusive Design
Episode Audio
Erica Zimmer is a Senior Instructional Designer who has been learning about Inclusive Design.
Connect with Erica:
To connect with any of the resources she referenced click these links:
Transcript:
The following transcript was auto-generated and may contain typos or spelling errors.
Amy:
Welcome to the share which you learned podcast. I'm Amy Petricek, learning and booziest and the host of this podcast to share what you learned podcast is designed for learning professionals to share something they're learning in the field of instructional design. Today I'm talking to Erica Zimmer, a senior instructional designer. Hi, Erica.
Erica:
Hi, Amy, I'm really happy to be here with you.
Amy:
It is a treat to have you here. Today we're going to talk inclusive design.
Erica:
Yes, it is something that I have been researching lately. And I'm really excited to share with you things I'm learning and I hope it will be useful for someone else.
Amy:
Great. Well, well, let's get started here. What is inclusive design, Erica, and how did you stumble into it?
Erica:
Okay, so there's this definition that I like from the inclusive research design center that I think really does a nice job of summarizing it into one sentence. So inclusive design is design that considers the full range of human diversity with respect to ability, language, culture, gender, age, and other forms of human difference. And I got into this because at my job, we had just done kind of a big virtual event, our team was instrumental in designing a lot of the presentations for that event. And so our boss had us kind of go through the feedback and reflect upon what we did and what we could do better. That's what I sort of thinking about this was the first time we did an event like this that was virtual most of the time, it's like a face to face like in person event we did I think we did a great job. But I also was I brought up the fact that we didn't touch a whole lot on things like accessibility and making sure we're reaching all possible people that might be attending this event. And that kind of led me down this whole route of thinking about not just accessibility, but all people and all human diversity, and reducing the risk of like alienating anyone making sure we're using a process that really reaches our learners and really thinks about them and tries to empathize with them as we're designing the learning like who who are the people we're trying to reach. So it's kind of like a process or method, or I've seen it become a philosophy of designing that really welcomes diverse people to engage with our work that says, You are welcome here. And we recognize you.
Amy:
I love that it's more of a way of thinking than it is checking boxes, like I did close captioning, I did alt tags, like all of those components.
Erica:
Yeah. And that kind of like they make you think about like, okay, closed captioning really helps with people who have some auditory impairments. But it also helps with second language learners, also helps like people who just prefer that method of learning, like I watch TV with closed captions, admit it, and I like, it just helps me process the information better, or, for example, transcripts, you know that that is not just for people with accessibility needs. It's also for people who might be dealing with the digital divide, and do not have adequate access. Or maybe they're traveling, because we have a lot of traveling people in our company, and they just don't have great access to the internet at that time, but they could download the transcript and read it instead. Also, transcripts are great for a second language learners, they could run the transcript through a translation tool to help them understand what is being said in that and read along with,
Amy:
I think what I hear you saying and all that is it's not necessarily a fix for accessibility issues, as much as it is a way of thinking about how to include all learners in the content being presented.
Erica:
Right? accessibility is like folded into it right? So it doesn't stop there. It kind of thinking about all of your learners and where they might be coming from. And are we representing them visually? Like if you're making a presentation, and you're using characters, are you mindful of the genders and the races in the clothing? And the ages of those characters? Are they you know, representing your diverse set of learners? Or are we showing that one race is more superior than others like there is it happens a lot more than you think you have to it's also about recognizing that we come to the table with our own implicit biases, being aware of that We all have implicit biases, the first step to recognizing are those biases happen. And we're human. And that can show up in our designs and to be able to reflect on that and just check yourself and your team. And you know, what we're putting out there is important, so important.
Amy:
Yeah, I love that you're bringing this to light. So early on in the podcast, that's really exciting to me to when Erica and I first started chatting about this, I was like, I am so excited to have this as a podcast episode like this is I was geeking out just like hearing her say, and talk more about inclusive design. So thank you.
Erica:
It's really interesting to me.
Amy:
So all that you're learning with inclusive design? How are you pulling that together into something tangible?
Erica:
Yes. So the idea and my boss love, I presented this idea to my boss about, you know, I think we should have some sort of tool to help us guide us with our design. I don't I don't quite know what that looks like. Yeah, but some sort of tool to help us reflect, you know, as we're designing, are we thinking about things like, are we using like language? Are we using language that is accessible in the sense that are we avoiding figures of speech and idioms and cliches that are super culturally rooted that not all of our learners will understand? And that make them feel left out? Are we also thinking about if we're using characters or visuals? Does it visually represent our audience? Are we thinking about those people who are you know, everything is digital right now? Everything is technology heavy. And are we thinking about those people who are a little more intimidated by technology? Are we providing the support upfront, in the center to them, everybody doesn't have to use it. But as long as like, here's how you get technical support, here's a quick little tutorial on how to use the video player, or how to navigate this course, like something optional, but have that available to those people who are a little bit more things like that, you know,
Amy:
As I'm thinking about maybe a little bit more of about this and actually like in the design of a course or a video or presentation, like, Is there something that you're building to help you think about inclusive design prior to the build that those things?
Erica:
Yeah, so it's gonna be like this Doc, I envision like a sort of like a document that we have that is easy enough, again, you know, being inclusive for anyone, not just instructional designers to use to kind of go through and, you know, ask them a series of questions in that setting that kind of same makeup I said, and they can like self evaluate their course, no way and decide, oh, maybe I need to go back and make sure I included this or, you know, maybe, oh, I have to go check my color combinations, or these poor contrast that might be difficult for people to read, things like that. So you can go through the list and self evaluate your course and process in that way.
Amy:
It’s just super cool to actually have something physical that you're working with as a guide. How many people have that out there? I think a lot of instructional designers in particular know that's a good practice and implemented as they're able to or with the resources that they have. But to actually have a guide that's drawing not only instructional designers, but other contributors to think about that. That's really cool.
Erica:
Yeah, and to try to break it down, like, you know, in general, and no matter what we design, we should be looking thinking about these things. But also okay, if this is say an elearning, there are very specific things about e learning, we can think about, or is this an instructor led event? Was it virtual instructor led? Like, what, what can we think about as we're designing for those specific learning events?
Amy:
That's awesome. So rare, so cool. I love that you're a part of that. And it just came from this place of, I see an opportunity for us to grow. And I want to be a part of that. And I'm going to take the initiative to learn all the things and find a way to implement it in a way that's helpful for our workflow. When you're doing some pretty cutting edge like innovative stuff.
Erica:
I hope so. I mean, I hope this is well received. I think it will be my bosses already really super curious about this and agrees with it. And the company I work for is really trying to do this big inclusive push about inclusive and diversity and really celebrating the diverse workforce we have and our diverse clients that we have, and it's top of their priority, which is why I love the company.
Amy:
Right and it should be top priority for every company. What an honor that you get to work for someone who's who's part of that.
Erica:
Yeah, I agree.
Amy:
I mean, as I'm thinking about inclusive design, obviously I see the direct impact with instructional design. But I also think it has a lot broader impact or implications like where else do you see inclusive design? Outside of the instructional design space?
Erica:
I think the philosophy really comes from like user experience design. And that whole, it feels a lot like that whole design thinking where you're empathizing with the end user, you're trying to design for them and with them in a way it would, it's hard in our big companies to get access to a lot of our learners, but it's something that we want to do. Right. So it's the same idea. I think, when you apply it outside of learning in say, technology, I think has a huge focus in thinking about how software is developed, and who it's targeting, and how we're representing people in the digital space, and how we're making the digital space, feel welcoming and inclusive for everybody.
Amy:
That makes me think of how many how many of our businesses now are remote. And that there's not this physical presence that's being used currently, where these messages of inclusivity are being communicated. And so we are in some regards, in a lot of ways reinventing what is inclusivity look like now that we're on virtual platforms all day, every day?
Erica:
Yeah. So I mean, it totally in every facet of our working life inclusive design could really be beneficial in how we interact with each other.
Amy:
Absolutely. So if someone else is wanting to learn about inclusive design, where's a good place for them to start?
Erica:
So I stumbled upon the place where I gave you the definition in the beginning is called the inclusive design Research Center. And I felt like they broke things down nicely. And I'm still kind of diving into their stuff. And I took a little LinkedIn learning course, as well, there is actually a LinkedIn learning course called inclusive instructional design or something like that, that I felt I walked away with some really golden nuggets from that, that made me think about things a little differently. I'm like, Oh, I think about closed captioning and that. And then there's this book, I haven't read it yet. So I don't know if I should be sharing. But you know, someone else recommended it to me. And it's called design justice. And the tagline is community led practices to build the world we need. And I just think that sounds like a really interesting book to help you kind of think about inclusive design in general, and how we design I think it's more geared towards user experience designers and things like that. But in the end, we are user experience designers in some small way, right? We're designing learning for these learners, where are the users? And we want that to be part of the design process.
Amy:
Well, thanks for sharing those resources with us. I'm curious if you'd be willing to read that definition of inclusive design to at least round out this portion of the podcast.
Erica:
Yeah, it is design that considers the full range of human diversity with respect to ability, language, culture, gender, age, other forms of human difference.
Amy:
Thank you. We're gonna go ahead and transition from here into the rapid round questions, the questions that each of my guests get to answer. So there's four here not to be too concerned, it's not a laundry list just for me. I'm going to start with the phrase learning is an Erica gets to fill in the rest
Erica:
Learning is being curious and wanting more. And I'll take it another step deeper learning is when you get to a point where you know that failure and making mistakes is essential to a personal and professional professional growth.
Amy:
Yes. And yes, I had someone say to me recently, I was exploring a new topic and trying something new and they're saying, Well, you know, you're like, you're probably going to fail, saying that more along the lines of like, just be prepared to like, stumble and fall. And I was like, oh, I wholeheartedly expect that. Like, it's part of the learning process.
Erica:
Yeah, be embrace that, like leap into that scary unknown area, because that's where you really grow and learn. Like it's just so important. Lean In, be comfortable with the uncomfortable
Amy:
Erica, when you're mustering up the courage to learn something new, What song do you put on?
Erica:
Lizzo good as hell.
Amy:
Yes, I can get behind that. We all have like our go to song of like, I need that pep talk to continue on in the learning process. I love that I can get behind Lizzo. You're asked to do a brand new task with a skill set you do not yet have where do you turn?
Erica:
So I guess perfect. Honestly, I feel really, really fortunate to be on the team, my peers and the boss. Let's ask each other questions, there's no stupid question. I'd rather you ask a question then to not ask it to flounder by yourself. And the instructional design community that I have like I just I've turned to that community with this actually with us inclusive design research. That's where I went to first because I posted something on LinkedIn and was like, hey, what have you done with inclusive design? What tools are there already developed? Because there wasn't a whole lot that I can find in my initial research about, like tools or processes or anything like that.
Amy:
That's a great idea. Tapping into the LinkedIn community.
Erica:
Yeah, I lean a lot on my community, even in personal life for stuff. That's awesome. And then, of course, the internet. You know, YouTube has everything. It really does.
Amy:
Alright, last rapid round without learning, finish the sentence, Erica,
Erica:
Without learning, I would not be where I am today, without leaping into the unknown and leaning into those scary parts, I probably would still working a job that provided a lot of anxiety and stress in my life. And now I'm in a much better place because I took that leap, I leaned into that I figured out where I needed to go and reflected and learned and like a beast.
Amy:
You learned like a beast. I kept seeing some glimmers of it she was on fire. So I can only imagine where this inclusive design will take you as well. Well, Erica, if people want to get in touch with you, what's a good way for them to connect with you after the show?
Erica:
Sure. I think probably LinkedIn at this point if you just look for Erica Zimmer. So that's linkedin.com/ericazimmer
Amy:
Well, thanks so much, Erica for sharing all about inclusive design with us today. I also want to give a shout-out to you my listeners for spending some time learning with us today. Make sure you hit the subscribe button so you don't miss out on any future episodes. Until next time, be open, receptive and kind.